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I've continually had a liking for the mystical, but it wasn't until I matured a little iota that I discovered John Maus!
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 Post subject: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:01 pm 
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little maus on the prairie

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 3:36 pm
Posts: 245
I'm trying to find the meaning of a hand gesture that ariel does in a video, but I can't remember what video he does it in. I was watching a talking heads music video and David Byrne does it which reminded me I had seen it before and then realized it was in an ap video. Byrne is influenced by odd religious groups and evangelical stuff but in the video you can see a clip of somebody doing the hand gesture in some sort of ceremonial display. The gesture is one hand making a slicing motion over the other arm. You can see it around 1:20 of the once in a lifetime video. Thanks for any help. Here's a link to the video: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I1wg1DNHbNU


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:20 pm 
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little maus on the prairie

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I found this which doesn't thoroughly answer my question, but I guess it's good enough to satisfy my curiosity. I think I can assume ariel took this move from byrne.

http://m.rapidcityjournal.com/blackhill ... touch=true


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:45 pm 
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little maus on the prairie
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interesting


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 2:15 am 
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very. i love the talking heads. i wonder what ariel's favorite heads track is. :sherlock:


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 2:16 am 
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i think ariel does this in the video for somewhere in europe/hotpink but i could be wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 2:19 am 
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nope its there. bout 40 seconds in...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Szahkz-yaWI


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:08 am 
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hippopotamaus

Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 10:47 am
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He sang part of "Sugar on My Tongue" on "On the Beach" from Thrash n Burn, so I'm guessing he likes the Heads.


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:32 am 
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little maus on the prairie

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 3:36 pm
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Cool, thanks for posting the video. I'm planning on listening to their album Fear Of Music soon, I came across it while searching for all the original artists of the songs that This Mortal Coil cover. The only Talking Heads track I listen to otherwise is This Must Be The Place, occasionally.

What's the "on the beach" song, I've never heard it. Is it a Nick Nicely cover too?


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2014 4:03 pm 
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Travis, I'm sure On The Beach is on Thrash & Burn
I don't believe it's a cover, but if it is, it's a pretty abstract one
nick nicely's song does rule, it's pretty ahead of its time with its ethereal quality
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqJpSwii0hE


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2014 4:10 pm 
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little maus on the prairie

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 3:36 pm
Posts: 245
Ah, ok, I remember listening to thrash and burn so I probably heard it. At the time I remember thinking that those recordings kinda brought Ariel down to my technical level and then I started to realize how much other musicians he collaborates with help him. I think I've also seen him in a studio getting his tapes mastered, but maybe that was something else. Maybe it was at that music college he attended.


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 Post subject: Re: Hand gesture meaning
PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:21 am 
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anonymaus

Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:16 am
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pinkspoons wrote: *
nope its there. bout 40 seconds in...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Szahkz-yaWI
Yes. It is identical. It is 43 seconds in.

In the Byrne version of the gesture there is an Indian or Pakistani or Bangladeshi woman doing the same hand dance in the background so I presume that it is traditional. Sorry, I see that the OP had pointed out the traditional nature of the gesture too.

It seem to be that Sigrid did a vaguely similar sort of chopping motion with her hands, so I googled Byrne and hand dance and arrived here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8vmRXpZoZ4


found it.
https://rapidcityjournal.com/blackhills ... 680d2.html
Interestingly, though, his signature gesture — the famous “arm chop” during the refrain, “Same as it ever was” — was inspired not by evangelical ministers but by Japanese dancers.

Byrne explains that he was visiting a Tokyo park one day when he saw several dancers wearing brightly colored, futuristic costumes. He shot some video footage of the dancers and it wasn’t until later—after seeing the footage of “Stop Making Sense” — that he realized that this arm movement was inspired by one of the Japanese dancers he had previously videotaped.

I am in Japan. There are a variety of Japanese hand dances. The shy Japanese are not so keen on moving their whole body due to shame unless they are very good at dancing, they are in front of a mirror (hence "dancing with myself" lyric in some song) or they can see the body part which they are moving, as is possible in hand dancing. It is still the norm in Okinawa. Here is some Tsugaru hand dancing from the North of Japan. It is not the one that Byrne copied.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J48oaHxhaY

The cross on the clothes in the Talking Heads video suggests that they are part of a religious group. Tenrikyo does hand dancing but I don't think that they use the symbol of the cross. The dancing religion near me (in Yamaguchi) did however mention Christ. I will look up their dance. I can't find the local dancing religion (Tenshō Kōtai Jingūkyō) dance on Youtube but it is called Muga no Mai (no-self dance) and it looks different. I am starting to realise that there are lot of religious hand-dances in Japan.

There is a miners song dance in which the hand gestures all refer to actions carried out by the miners (digging, carrying coal, and pushing a truck) so this arm chop may have some reference to manual labour or perhaps chopping up vegetables!

But then again, it really does look religious due to the cross and the fact that the dancer is wearing a badge in the centre of her dress picturing a woman with mickey maus ear like hairstyle. There are a lot of Japanese (newish) religions founded by women including
Tenshō Kōtai Jingūkyō (Kitamura Sayo) (mentioned above)
Tenrikyō (Miki Nakayama)
Oomotokyō (Nao Deguchi)
Tenchiseikyō (Kayo Kawase)

And Miki Nakayama had big hair
https://www.kosho.or.jp/products/detail ... =136996501
But this move does not seem to be a part of the famous Tenrikyō hand dance
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxBAOgGUh8I

Kayo Kawase also had big hair
http://tinyurl.com/y7nns2xw
but I can find no mention of a dance. However, they were claimed to be affiliated with the Family Federation for World Peace and Unification (also known as the unification church and the "Moonies" after the name of the founder), may use Christian symbols, being a unification church. The Family Federation (of Korea) does do a dance called the Unconditional with lots of hand movements, but I can't see this one in particular e.g. in this group of suited Korean dancers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wUkob5tVV4


I have never head of Maus but I will google him too. Aha. Friend of Pink.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:52 am 
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anonymaus

Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:16 am
Posts: 2
I think I have found the preliminary answer: During the early eighties, for a brief period of time, there was a fad in Tokyo for kids to wear brightly coloured self-made clothes, including "bloomer" style trousers and upper body clothing secured with badges (that probably represented their dance troupe or troupe leader). They were called bamboo sprout families or Bamboo Shoots (take no ko zoku) due to the fact that they often purchased their brightly coloured clothes at a boutique by that name, and they disappeared by the late eighties when I arrived in Japan. Being Japanese dancers they were keen on hand movements. Foreigners found them fascinating and took pictures of them.

Here are a couple of videos of Bamboo sprout Family dancers in Harajuku park and in a club today (in their late fourties)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R880jDYeT0g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB0LAx0mNsU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9I6x2zEI4s
Japanese wikipedia article with names of the most famous troupes
https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%AB%B9 ... 0%E6%97%8F
And this is the google auto-translation of the same article:
http://tinyurl.com/yademazs

Some of the troupe names are Christianity influenced including one called "Maria" I can't find the group ending in 日十 that appears to be written on the sleeve of the dancer but more than one group used the 日 character (meaning day or sun).

And here is a gif of David Byrne for comparison
https://makeagif.com/i/PY6Lkw


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